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Alicia
27-10-04, 15:48
On the american family records at Ancestry which I subscribe to, they have listed 2,178 men born Finland on the draft registration cards.I can actually view the cards and can make out where some of them were born in Finland , if they stated it. Example, John Albert Forsberg from Delta county was born in Isokyro Finland.
Would a complete listing be of any help for your project for Finn Fest?
Alicia

syrene
27-10-04, 17:30
Hi Alicia,
Yes! That's very helpful! An often overlooked resource. And so many people didn't come back from the battlefields! If a bullet didn't get them, it was the gas. And then the infection from wounds, and then the Spanish influenza.

An interesting book I'm just now reading describes Duluth and its surroundings in the years leading up to WWI. The question of taking out citizenship and immediately becoming eligible for the draft was troubling to those who had left Finland in order not to be conscripted into the army. They were trying to avoid being cannon fodder for "rich men's wars". The book's title is "Soumalaiset, People From the Marsh". It's been published recently by Mark Munger at Cloquet River Press. 538 pages and I'm about 450. He's done terrific amounts of research. and includes a lot of resources, especially Internet sites, which I plan to look at.

the thing that surprised me is that he catches the attitudes so well of the average working stiff, and the logging camps and getting the jobs done in the woods, on the steamers, on the river floating logs, what people did for the Sunday off, in the boarding houses.

It's a good read.

Regards,
Syrene

Alicia
27-10-04, 20:44
Hi,
The book sounds like a must read to me. Will have to see if the Northwoods has it yet.
I realized also on the draft registration that the birthdates of the men are also included. An added plus.
Here is what part of them state:
Name birth born County
John Albert Forsberg 27 Nov 1887 Caucasian Finland;Russia Not Stated, Alger, MI
Anders Victor Forsman 28 Mar 1888 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Everette Haikonen 1 Nov 1890 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
John Hakala 15 Jul 1892 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Nicholas Hakala 22 Jan 1889 White Finland Not Stated, Alger,
Jacob Hakkola 16 Nov 1888 Caucasian Finland;Europe Not Stated, Alger, MI
Yalo Hankonen 5 Apr 1896 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
David Hanninen 20 Nov 1890 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Note on some Mongolian!
I don't have an Excel program on my computer so I am trying to use something else.
Alicia

granskare
28-10-04, 00:09
Hi Alicia,
Nice info you have and it will surely be useful.
I tried the 2 Swede-Finn names with my Alger County database and those guys were not church members:)

1. If you don't have excel, you can try another spreadsheet and Hasse can convert to excel from that. I had done stuff in quattropro and it had an early version of xls on it.
2. You can also transcribe into html, especially if you have netscape composer.
3. Hasse probably can come up with the solution for you - all Finns know how to do this.

Chuck

syrene
28-10-04, 01:17
According to the novelist and his research, congress attempted to reclassify Finns as Mongolians in order to exclude their entry based on their Asian origins!!!
Like that cartoon this morning in Non Sequiter. Put out a wild story, and some place will publish it, and some one will believe it. I still get comments about "well you know Finns are from Mongolia." Can't believe it!
Syrene

kpaavola
28-10-04, 03:52
Hi Syrene,
I remember a long time ago, my "scholarly" brother told me that Finns originated from the Mongolians. I vaguely recall some discussion on either this forum or the old mailing list about that as well.

I may have to google tonight and see if I can find anything on it. Of course the times "they" refer to are like from the Stone Age.

:rolleyes:

Paivi T
28-10-04, 07:16
Tee-hee, especially we blonde, blue-eyed, round-eyed, fair-skinned, freckled Finns still are the spitting images of our Mongolian ancestors... :D

Päivi T

Alicia
28-10-04, 15:07
Hee , Hee, I had an 82 year old friend of mine who happens to be Finnish tell me that we descended from Mongols.I about laughed myself silly. What an old myth that never left the older generation.
By the way, I am finding a little treasure with the WW1 Draft cards, not only birth dates but where born in Finland, if married and how many children, where they worked and if they had any existing medical conditions. I am putting in the place of birth "as written" as some of them are not readable. I think that I will take out the "not stated".It just means what town they lived in since the county is stated anyway. I have a complete list of names allready but now I have to look at every draft card.

August Severin Berg 14 Jun 1891 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Petalaks Wassan Finland Single

Walfred Leonard Berg 10 Oct 1891 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Helsingfors Finland Single

Carl Oscar Bergholm 26 Dec 1888 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Kristinestad Finland Single

Emil Borkka 26 Aug 1891 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Korkiakaski WL Finland Single

Yalmer Erinkentalo 12 Oct 1888 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Sikkanen TPL Finland Wife and 3? Children under 12

Oscar Esterholm 10 Jun 1886 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Vasa Finland Wife and 3 children

Arue Fors 22 Feb 1896 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Yyriskyl? Finland Single

John Albert Forsberg 27 Nov 1887 Caucasian Finland;Russia Not Stated, Alger, MI
Tsojoki/Isojoki? Finland Wife 2 children

Anders Victor Forsman 28 Mar 1888 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Lappfjord Finland Wife 1 child

Everette Haikonen 1 Nov 1890 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Waasa Finland Single

John Hakala 15 Jul 1892 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
R/Pyntaast??? IL or PL Finland Single

Nicholas Hakala 22 Jan 1889 White Finland Not Stated, Alger,
Uraisalla Finland Single

Jacob Hakkola 16 Nov 1888 Caucasian Finland;Europe Not Stated, Alger, MI
Waasa Finland Wife 2 children

Yalo Hankonen 5 Apr 1896 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Pormakku Finland Single

David Hanninen 20 Nov 1890 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Mikkeli Finland Single.
The only county that I have not found draft cards for was Ontonagon! Strange.
Alicia

syrene
28-10-04, 19:27
Hi Alicia,
The fact that those cards list parish of birth is great. That will be of enormous help to those whose antecedents are in your list. Over two thousand people could possibly be helped to find their roots in Finland! Yippee skippee! (My high school students used to think I was a little crazy when I expressed joy in such manner.)

Re: Ontonagon. Could the cards have been filed under the name of the nearest large city? It is odd.

Are you going to send the completed file to Hasse for Delphi?

Good going!

Syrene

Alicia
28-10-04, 19:45
Yes, I will be sending the file to Hasse. It will take some time to finnish having to read every image on each card. I am wondering if Ontonagon was filed with Marquette's as there were many in that county.
At 7;11 this morning my son Stephen , turned 13 years old! :D
Alicia

syrene
28-10-04, 19:55
Best birthday wishes to Stephen! I'll bet he loves the lake place. I used to love the woods, and the swamp. Came home so muddy, mother would make me hose off before getting into the basement to warm up!

I think I was 20 before any improvement in behavior was noticed:) Now I'm an old grandmother whose bones don't like the cold at all. Art's got me, as one old fellow used to say. Arthritis that is.

And how is it that you remember the minute he was Born? At this stage of my life, I'm just lucky to remember dates!
:)
Syrene

granskare
29-10-04, 05:28
26h August Severin Berg Jun 4 1891 Petalax 1910 216

Hi Alicia,
So far I found one guy who was a church member so I put his line above. This shows him married, born Jun 4 1891 at Petalax parish and emigration date of 1910 and 216 is the Swenson id number for the church microfilm which is:
Swenson 216 = Alger County, Grand Marais, Sw. Ev. Lutheran

Chuck, uh, not blond or blue-eyed :eek:

Alicia
29-10-04, 20:36
I just finished the draft cards for Alger county At first, the writing was ledigble but gets worse as the names go on. Do you think that I should remove the Mongolian title? So far the majority seem to be from Vaasa, at least in Delta.I think that the W.L. after some towns indicate province. Here are a few that are
mangled but I put the spelling in as stated, I don't think that I should second guess spellings on this.
Eeli Holmberg 3 Jul 1894 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Vaarijarvi W.L. Finland Single
Anthony Holmin 14 Jan 1891 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Mirekaiva, Tyaja, Finland Single
Alfred Holmstrom 7 Dec 1893 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Aravais , Finland Single.
Eric Holmstrom Dec 1889 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Aravais, Married Wife and child in Finland
John Edward Hungisto 23 Sep 1889 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Ponisch? Finland Married
Joseph Huntanen 9 May 1889 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Jisal?nivarpa kyla Finland Single Mother
Kusta Alexander Ilkka 18 Dec 1890 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Varhakyln?Phhar? Finland Wife and 2 children
Edward Jakinen 8 Jul 1887 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
?klainen Finland Single
Yalmar Jalonen 15 Jan 1887 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Manhijarvi Finland Mother
Henry Yalmari Jarvenpa 30 Aug 1887 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Sikainen, T.L. Finland Mother and Father
Arvid Johnson 9 Jun 1888 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Vasa, Finland Single
Charles Victor Johnson 25 Jan 1892 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Jyvaskyla, Finland Single
Emil Johnson 7 Dec 1895 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
H/Kirtas? St. Michael Finland Single
John Johnson 10 May 1890 Mongolian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI ?
?irt?salmi Finland Single Father
William Johnson 14 May 1892 White Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
Wirtasalmi St. Michael Finland Wife and 1 child.
William Johnson 9 Nov 1890 Caucasian Finland Not Stated, Alger, MI
La? Finland Mother
Alicia

syrene
30-10-04, 01:11
Yes, I agree. Second-guessing can also be wrong. But about the Mongolian classification?? I think the information from the cards needs to be kept intact. Someday, a hundred years down the line, someone may not have access to the cards, and they might be researching US attitudes towards Finns around WW1. I know that last year SFHS had a PhD candidate going through old newspaper clippings looking for political cartoons about Finns in the states and Canada. Some were not at all complimentary, but they were important to his work.

And what is the "not stated" part again? Makes me curious.
Syrene

Alicia
30-10-04, 18:39
Hi Syrene,
The "not stated" is what town that they lived in , in the county.
Ok, I will leave the Mongolian in. My husband had a good laugh
over seeing that.
It was interesting to read the person's comments one the health of some of them. I noted that there was old axe wound entered in quite a few.The ones that dumbfounded me is where the interviewer wrote that the person did not know where they were born or the date.Sounds "fishy" to me, unless they were mentally incompetent.
Alicia

syrene
30-10-04, 19:06
Hi,
Maybe it was a belated attempt to avoid being traced, that is from Finland. Some emigrants left Finland to escape the draft, others to escape a family commitment, and who knows what else. What they didn't think about was that the community around them kept very good track of who was doing what and where and writing home. Some people totally disappeared. I believe that some died from various causes, but others purposefully headed for points unknown, changed their names, and learned the new language very quickly.
Syrene

Karen Norwillo
30-10-04, 20:23
Alicia, In viewing those draft cards at random, while the main screens say "not listed," in almost all cards viewed, both the town where they lived and the town where they were registering were given. Some of those cards have a wealth of information. Too bad some of the writing was so illegible. Karen

Alice Finnerty
12-11-04, 15:42
Is this information you talk about for WW one only or is there WW 2 also? I had 4 uncles and my father in WW2. Two uncles
were born in Esse Finland.
Sons of Matts Leander Andersson Jossgark

Emil Edvin (Mattsson Jossgak)
8-4-1908

Gunnar Sigfrid (Mattsson Jossgark)
11-12-1911

When they emigrated to America they took the name
Anderson

All this information posted is very interesting!
Thanks - Alice

Alicia
12-11-04, 15:55
Hi,
The only ones listed for WWII are for that and Korean War interred overseas(Killed). I have a great uncle listed but it lists very little in information.
Alicia

Alicia
13-11-04, 19:17
I am working on the draft cards for Dickinson Count Michigan.
I had to stop for a giggle break. Get this, not bad enough we were classified as Mongolian now I find some classifed in Dickinson county as born in Finland Poland are are colored!

Ruben Robertson 22 Oct 1890 Colored Finland Not Stated, Dickinson, MI
O--na Finland Wife 1 child Al.
Wilhelm Routell 16 Jan 1893 Caucasian Finland Poland Not Stated, Dickinson, MI
Maryham Finland Poland Single Dec.
I am laughing so hard at this.:D :D
Alicia

kpaavola
13-11-04, 21:59
Weren't the Laplanders dark skinned? I think we had a discussion about this a long time ago. Can't imagine they'd be that dark to be classified as "colored". :)

Alicia
13-11-04, 22:27
I do think that the Lapps were mostly dark skinned but i have found the majority of Dickinson County were Swede Finns it would appear so far. That is what gave me giggle fits. My g.granfather Johan Winqvist was fair skinned, bright blue eyes and fair haired. A Polish Finnish person of color??? (snort laugh)
Alicia:p

kpaavola
13-11-04, 22:36
Indeed, that is rather funny! :D

Alicia
13-11-04, 22:47
The following were from Esse Finland on the Civilain Draft:
ame Birth Date Birth Place City/County State Ethnicity Save This

Jacobson, Jacob E. 4 Dec 1887 Esse Finland Dolores CO W
Mattson, Alexander 3 Sep 1886 Esse County Finland Dolores CO W


England, Alexander 2 Sep 1886 Esse Finland Cook MN W
Englund, Alexander 2 Sep 1886 Esse Finland Cook MN W
Johnson, Alfred 12 Mar 1891 Kallby Esse Finland Elmore ID W
Englund, Emil 26 Jan 1888 Esse Finland Bonner ID W
Englund, Lee 19 Aug 1893 Esse Finland Bonner ID W
Fors, Johan Victor 13 Feb 1890 Esse Finland Bonner ID W
Nygard, Herman 11 Oct 1893 Esse Finland Bonner ID W
Sundgreist, Fred 23 Aug 1887 Esse Finland Bonner ID W
Lindquist, John 23 Jan 1893 Esse Wasalieu Finland Shoshone ID W
Sundquist, John 24 Jun 1891 Esse Finland Shoshone ID W
Anderson, Edward 7 Aug 1888 Esse Finland King# 2 WA W
Alicia

granskare
17-11-04, 06:01
at Swenson S 25-3 = Iron Mountain, First Lutheran

c3h Carl Ruben Ivar Robertson Oct 22 1889 Åland unk S 25-3

c3h=page 3 of the third book on the microfilm h=husband. Born Oct 22 1889 at Åland, emigration date not given.
.................................................. ...
Routell - not listed Dickinson County
.................................................. ....
Jossgak - also not listed in Dickinson County.

Chuck

Alicia
17-11-04, 15:10
Ancestry has the following draftcards listed born Aland
Name Birth Date Birth Place City/County State Ethnicity Save This

Danileson, Gustave Mauristz 6 Mar 1888 Aland Finland McCarthy AK W
Westerlund, Gustave Einar 29 Dec 1891 Aland Finland Russia Ketchikan AK W
Anderson, Axel E. 11 Jan 1890 Aland Finland Mono CA W
Axelsen, Antone 10 Dec 1877 wife lives Aland Finland San Francisco# 1 CA W
Aarne, Erik Gunnar 1 Mar 1897 Aland Finland NYC (Brooklyn)# 45 NY W
Anderson, Ellis 28 Feb 1893 Fendstrom Aland Finland Clearwater ID W
And these as Oland :
Name Birth Date Birth Place City/County State Ethnicity Save This

Carlson, Matthias William 6 Nov 1893 Oland Finland Ruby AK W
Holmes, Aolgot 3 Jun 1892 Oland Finland NYC (Bronx)# 1 NY W
Anderson, John V. 27 Apr 1890 Oland Finland NYC (Manhatta# 132 NY W
Andersen, John V. 27 Apr 1890 Oland Finland NYC (Manhatta# 132 NY W

Alicia