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Hasse
02-02-05, 22:21
Members of this forum who have their email accounts at Verizon might be interested in reading this article (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/01/14/verizon_email_block/).

Email from Europe to Verizon accounts are all treated as spams as if all spams would originate from Europe...


Verizon media relations manager Ells Edwards told Wired that he didn't know when the ISP would lift its blockade. "Normally these things abate in a matter of days," Edwards said.

Verizon three million DSL customers waiting for emails from Europe were advised to use alternative forms of communication. "If it's really important you might want to make a phone call," he said.

If you are a verizon customer - and dont get emails from Europe - complain to you ISP or better change ISP! According to Verizon's policy email from Europe iis SPAM by definition and default. From what I see most of the spams are delivered via email addresses ending in hotmail.com, msn.com and yahoo.com... The originating IP-numbers can mostly also be found either in USA and in Asia.

Jaska Sarell
03-02-05, 13:24
Indeed Verizon could have achieved much better results in spam prevention by blocking all US based IPs. Reducing over 90% of spam would have been much more heartily welcomed by users than the mere 2% or so. Of course, that would have reduced wanted email as well, but all remedies tend to have some side effects...

:confused: Jaska

Hasse
03-02-05, 17:14
One example...

Since morning some 39 spams dropped into one of my email inboxes. 37 of these I could trace to an US IP number. All spams that were non-pornographic tried to sell american products - all exept an "Authentic Reproduction Wristwatch" -spam which sold stuff produced in Singapore.

The porn & drug spams seem to come from all over the world, mostly US IP-numbers and Japan. CitiBank etc "please give me your ATM codes" -emails can be traced to the US...

I'm afraid the American ISPs should look in the mirror before ponting fingers at Europe! ISPs such as Verizon should be taught a lesson and see their customers leave them for other ISPs.

Likewise the "email accounts for free" -type of services should be shut down since they are one of the biggest collectors of valid email addresses. These adressed are then sold to "direct marketing".

Well - the spams are now safe in the bit bucket where they belong.

Jaska Sarell
03-02-05, 20:42
Of course, Verizon is afraid of the law! They cannot block spam based on the content as it could be from US.
Quote from Spamhaus (http://www.spamhaus.org/) :
[United States set to Legalize Spamming on January 1, 2004]
Some spammers are claiming that CAN-SPAM not only allows them to spam legally but that it protects them further by also making it illegal for anti-spam systems to block their spam. In fact, while CAN-SPAM is an abysmally poor law, at least it does have some parts which attempt to address the issue of blocking spam, specifically it states that the law does not impact an ISP's ability to determine and enforce its own policies for transmission of email (i.e: through the use of blocklists or whatever means the ISP likes). This means that spammers cannot sue ISPs for blocking the mail they send claiming that the ISP must accept and deliver it based on the Federal law.

Fortunately ISPs in Europe can use whatever means to block spam. Unfortunately they don't seem to do it free.

:( Jaska

Jaska Sarell
03-02-05, 21:11
Forgot to include the link to statistics at Spamhaus. Look here (http://www.spamhaus.org/statistics.lasso)

:eek: Jaska

Nicholas
05-11-05, 04:18
Well, it is almost 8 months since the last post that I could find about Verizon, on the forum. As a Verizon user, who is not very happy with them, I can agree with much of what has been said before, and add a bit more.

Now, Verizon blocks some, but not all servers in Europe. They also block many servers in Japan. I know this because the companies I do business there are blocked. I receive my client's and colleague's mail from Japan on my free accounts, because Verizon does not block those servers. Curious though, I receive much spam on Verizon address; no (and I mean NO) spam, on the free accounts.

Could this be a problem with Verizon's choice of software to block spam?

Nicholas

Hasse
05-11-05, 20:29
Nothing has happened during these months. Verizon is still boycotting the email server we use when emailing - for example - from Finlander.

During the last week abt. 5-10 notices about PMs from one Finlander member to another was refused by the Verizon email servers. The last PM was to wm.dahlin ((at)) verizon.net...

These messages haven't reached their recipients thanks to Verizon

Hasse Andtbacka
05-11-05, 21:28
I sent mail to Finlander member dmjay from 5 different addresses to his verizon address. Only one arrived, but the next day also this way was blocked.
Verizonusers: verizon is completely unreliable; you never know how much mail dosn't come trough...

Hasse Andtbacka

Hasse
06-11-05, 16:39
Just a moment ago again a message that bounced...


<xxx.xxx(at)verizon.net>:
host relay.verizon.net[206.46.232.11] said:
550 You are not allowed to send mail:sv10pub.verizon.net
(in reply to MAIL FROM command)


...so if you Verizon customers (and there are a few of you out there among the Finlander members) want to get email from Europeans, please either switch your email account to another ISP or try to get Verizon to become more aware of the situation. The number of bounces coming each day is becoming disturbing.

As things are just now - Verizon and Verizon customers simply are saying that they won't accept email from Europe. If this would be traditional snail mail - wouldn't you react? Censurship??

Hasse

Edit: today's total 4 bounced email messages from Verizon! :mad: Perhaps it would be better to post messages to the discussion forum instead of having all the discussion person-to-person over PMs? If the content isn't too private of course... /Hasse

Hasse
06-03-06, 16:32
...still going strong.

I notice that people - even Finlander members - are switching over to Verizon. Today I again got a message that a member has become a Verizon customer. Of course I cannot email him to say that he will probably never get an email again from most of the Finnish email servers. Bye bye contacts to Finland!!

But as the manager at Verizon states in a web page: "Verizon three million DSL customers waiting for emails from Europe were advised to use alternative forms of communication. "If it's really important you might want to make a phone call," he said.

Dear Verizon users: If you intend to get email from Europe - please force Verizon to accept the emails coming from us. Verizon don't listen to us, probably we are living to near the old iron curtain...or is it so that the US is guarding itself from messages from the rest of the world as did the Soviet Union before...?

Boycott Verizon!

Hasse
06-03-06, 16:53
Verizon is blocking ranges of IP addresses belonging to British and European ISPs (the IP space from RIPE, APNIC, and more) in a misguided attempt to reduce spam. Domains are only unblocked following complaints, with Europeans effectively treated as guilty till proven innocent.


Verizon Blocks EMail from Western Europe to Avoid Spam (http://getreal.corante.com/archives/2005/02/08/verizon_blocks_email_from_western_europe_to_avoid_ spam.php)
Verizon, heal thyself (http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=21095)
Verizon blocks European email by default. (http://www.interesting-people.org/archives/interesting-people/200501/msg00163.html)
Verizon persists with European email blockade (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/01/14/verizon_email_block/)
...

Hasse
27-03-06, 12:41
...ie. no emails get though to you Verizon customers.


...rejected by relay.verizon.net:
550 You are not allowed to send mail:sv20pub.verizon.net...

Seems like no Verizon users show any activity to secure that their email will get though???!!! Aren't you Verizon users at all bothered about not getting your email? In the former Soviet Union they had no choice -- but you should have!

From now on I will not manually forward messages intended to Verizon users via other emailing channels. No messages that you have got new personal messages. No password resets.

Those who have Verizon email accounts and haven't discussed the problem with their ISP simply have to suit themselves... I have made you aware of the problem during the past year without any noticable changes. Either no one of you Verizon customers have contacted your own ISP or Verizon simply doesn't care. But since Verizon doesn't trust Europeans it means that you Verizon customers have to react. No one else can do anything about it. -- Have you btw signed contracts with Verizon where Verizon has the right to censur your email??? -

So Verizon customers - go call your ISP today. It is your duty and your ISP's responsibility to stop the censorship of email from Europe! Otherwise -- you will not get email from Europe and Finlander in the future either!

From a fed up and frustrated webmaster fighting the windmills

William Dahlin
27-03-06, 16:40
Hasse

My ISP is verizon but I use Yahoo as my e-mail provider.
Since I switched to Yahoo I have had no problem in getting
my e-mail from Finland or Sweden. Will I be cut off from
Finlander Forum becuase my ISP is Verizon. Verizon is
my only DSL provider at this time.

Hasse
28-03-06, 07:52
Nobody will be cut off from Finlander, but since many of the Finlanders are still using Verizon email addresses I will not manually process all the so called "bouncing" emails when for example another Finlander member is trying to send a message to a Verizon user.

But - I underline - nobody is being kicked out!

socar
03-04-06, 13:22
Just want everyone to know that I provided my relatives an alternate email address after I switched to Verizon.net in March. In the past week I have received 3 emails - 2 from Finland and 1 from Sweden into my Verizon account without any trouble.

Hasse
03-04-06, 16:17
It is nice, Carl, that you got some email from Scandinavia to your Verizon email box - let us hope that nothing valuable is among the many that don't come through. The problem is that one cannot be nearly sure that all email comes through! Since Verizon adapted the censorship policy I have tried to convince them that email from Finlander is no spam. They did something but now some one email out of 40 seems to go through.

I really wonder how many would accept the same in traditional (snail-) mailing? That every sender of a postcard would have to convince the recipients post office that he is not sending "spam"?

Even though some email goes through to some Verizon customers occasionally I have to stress that it is a censorship.

I just tried to send Carl an email from two different email accounts -- both came back as a boomerang, fast and as clockwork.

Hasse

Nicholas
04-04-06, 17:34
As a Verizon customer who needed DSL, and could not have it installed by other reputable companies, we are without an option for our business. Verizon DSL, or back to dial-up.

And, as our business is primarily with people in other countries--and e-mail is the most important form of communication for our busiess--I have had several very 'warm' discussions with Verizon about their blocking e-mail to us from abroad.

Their repsonse: Please add the names of people you wish to receive mail from to your 'White List' and their mail will come through.

Fine, provided that I KNOW each person who will send me mail. The fact is, it is the people whom I do not yet know who are the ones I need to receive mail from...they are my potential, new clients.

And, the White List concept--at least as Verizon has set it up--is not prrfect. My colleague in Japan --with whom I exchange e-mail often--still must send mail to me through my:

- Hotmail.com account

-Google.mail. com account

-Yahoo.com account

(ALL of his mail arrvies to these accounts without any difficulty..it just means I must take time to check them all.)

One thing that those of us who must have Verzion service can do, is to collect our mail directy from our webmail accounts. By doing this, there is a good chance that you will be able to remove real mail from the SPAM folder or Trash, and prevent Verizon from rejecting at least some of your mail. (This is also a handy way to clear mail that you do NOT want, before you click on 'Get Mail' and wind up downloading real spam.)

By the way, I do receive mail from many other countries, without any problem. In fact, the number of e-mails I receive from Nigeria--offering me millions, if I will just send along my bank information--is staggering. ;-)

Hope this helps...

Nicholas

Jaska Sarell
04-04-06, 22:39
Is Verizon by any chance led by Kim Jong Il?
The policy at least sounds similar except that he wouldn't let anything go out either. Perhaps a tiny concession for other shareholders?

BTW. I recently decided to pay small extra to my ISP for spam filtering (they use SpamAssassin), which seems to work just fine. After adding a few allowed senders (news or similar mass email, which easily are considered) and receivers (postlists), all mail in their Spam Box has really been junk. Less than 10% comes through though - spammers' strategies change all the time.
Just before that I analyzed the headers of about 200 spam mails, and identified the originating IP address owners with Who Is servers like RIPE, LACNIC, ARIN. Three topmost countries China, USA and Korea (South) were responsible for 40% of spam. Others came far behind and the small sample doesn't qualify to put them in any order. Some Europeans seemed to be DSL customers, meaning probably that there's some security leak in their ISP's system. The sender addresses, of course, were all faked - they tell nothing about the real origin. Latest two that came through (the same "message") had some verizon.net address, but they really from the same source in Canada.

Send Verizon back to the USSR, where it belongs!
OK, it doesn't exist any more - to Pyongyang then.

:) Jaska

Elaine Goren
05-04-06, 19:16
From today's Providence Journal newspaper

Verizon considers refunds in blocked e-mail lawsuit by Maryclaire Dale, Associated Press

"Philadelphia---Verizon Communications Inc. is proposing refunds to Internet customers who found legitimate e-mail from friends and businsses blocked by the company's spam filters.

In announcing a tentative settlement of a class-action lawsuit, Verizon said it has since refined it's junk e-mail blockers to reduce such mistakes.

Verizon has blocked e-mail altogether from certain overseas Internet service providers---mostly from Europe and Asia---and failed to properly handle complaints, said Philadelphia attorney Michael Boni.

He said that Verizon servers could not handle an increase in e-mail volume---and spam---before the 2004 holiday season. so the company decided to block e-mail from certain geographic areas.

Verizon spokeswoman Bobbi Henson, however, said the filters were not designed to target any such regions.

The proposed settlement, if approved by the Los Angeles judge overseeing the case, covers business and residential customers who had broadband or dial-up service from Oct. 1 2004 to May 31 2005.

Customers could potentially get awards of $3.50 per month or up to $28, plus any cancellations fees charged for dropping their service over missing e-mail.

Verizon has notified customers about the claim process. Information is also available at http://www.emailblockingsettlement.com"

This doesn't sound very generous to me!
Elaine

Hasse
05-04-06, 22:00
So now we have a price on and of censorship, 28$. But - doesn't this mean that Verizon can continue with their I suppose illegal policy? And after this decision supposedly other companies and organisations in the US also may censor email they are supposed forward to their customers?

What I don't understand is why Verizon doesn't filter spams like all other ISPs do? Capacity problems? Poor technology in use? An email vendor should forward all the email and filter out only the spams and virus emails! Since they can do it here in Europe inspite of heavy bombardment of spams and virus email they should be able to do it in the US. And - I'm fairly sure that the amount of email served per server is in the same magnitude as for Verizon!

I'm still wondering how it can be that ordinary people in a democracy can stand censorship!

All forms of mail, snailmail to email, are based upon the idea that the distribution system can relay the message from the sender to the receiver using transport agents who must not interfer with the content of the mail. Interference, ie. censorship, is something that takes place in totalitarian states or states at war.

Jaska Sarell
05-04-06, 23:25
Just looked at the SpamAssassin site (the spam filter software my ISP uses). It's free, but can be installed only in several Linux distributions and with some tricks in Mac OSX. Apparently V uses M, another monopol.
Their tendency is to never ask customers what they want, but tell them what they are allowed to want :mad:
Exactly like in North Korea.

:) Jaska