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Terry Reigel
27-12-05, 01:19
I'm writing to introduce myself, as a new member of the forum. I am now in Boone, North Carolina, USA. My wife and I are retired nearly 10 years, and I'm now seriously hooked by family history. :)

In addition to researching my ancestors and my wife's, I'm very engaged with user support for The Master Genealogist software. I've written over 75 articles on how to use the program which appear on my website, at http://tmg.reigelridge.com - some now in German.

Most of our ancestry is German and English, but my Great-grandmother emigrated from Finland to Portland, Oregon in 1888. Many of her siblings moved to the same area, including southern and central Washington. According to information I've received from Dick Erickson, who has published several articles on the family, our ancestors were at Påvall since about 1680.

I'm trying to learn more about my Finnish ancestors, who they were, and something about how they lived. I've already learned that Jaska Sarell on this forum is a cousin, and he's provided some helpful information. I'd love to meet others who share common interests.

Terry Reigel

June Pelo
27-12-05, 01:33
Terry,

I have some links to Påvals, and also many links to Jaska, so I probably am related to you in some way..

June

Terry Reigel
27-12-05, 02:13
June, if you'd like to take a look, the bare bones of my ancestry is posted at http://reigelridge.com/family - my immigrant g-grandmother was Matilda Henriksdotter, who can be found by the index on the left side. I have no delusions all that's there is correct - I'd love to share information.

Terry

Jim Bailey
27-12-05, 23:12
Hi, Terry ----

Like you, I'm retired (only two years so far), and I'm addicted to genealogy. Many of us have contributed our research to the TALKO project, listed at the top of Finlander. I believe you can get a password from our coordinator, Hasse Nygård.

In any case, your Beata Henriksdotter Påvals (1755-1823) is my fourth cousin, six times removed. So, you and I are related too.

Will be glad to exchange information on Finlander or privately via:

jbailey1*iupui.edu

All the best for 2006,

:) :) :)

Jim Bailey
27-12-05, 23:14
Sorry, e-mail should have been

jbailey1*iupui.edu

Age catching up with my eyesight.

:)

Jim Bailey
27-12-05, 23:43
Hi again, Terry ----

According to my FamilyTreeMaker software, you and I are tenth cousins. In addition, you and I have Granholm cousins in DeQuincy, Louisiana, as well as Granholm cousins in Williamsburg, VA.

My Sandstrom first cousins in northern Wisconsin are also related to you, and one of them (Irma) had nine (!!) children. So, there are LOTS of cousins around the Ashland, WI, area. They have family reunions every so often.

Will be glad to send all info I have. Obviously, the "star" which keeps appearing in my e-mail address should be an "at" symbol.

jbailey1*iupui.edu

All the best. :)

Terry Reigel
28-12-05, 02:12
That sounds great, Jim. I'd love to exchange notes. I've sent you an e-mail.

Terry

June Pelo
28-12-05, 02:28
Terry,

I took a look at your webpage - lots of names that might be linked - but all my data is recorded by farm name (as surname) and I note you recorded your names using just patronymics. It would take a lot of work to find links...

June

Terry Reigel
28-12-05, 02:40
Yes, I'm still working on how to get that right. I posted another thread on the subject of farm names in the Genealogy Forum a couple of weeks ago. I'm torn between the issue of making it easy to find people and what I understand is historically more accurate (if I've got this right, farm names were not actually used as names by people in those times).

It's easy for me to do both in my software, which lets me find people easily and still keep what I think are historically accurate names for reports. I've not yet figured out how to do it on my website, but I think it's possible.

On the other hand, if my understanding is wrong, I'd love to be better informed. :)

Terry

Terry Reigel
28-12-05, 18:42
I've added farm names, as I have them. They appear in the index, but not in the listing for each person. Does this help?

I suspect there are lots of errors - any corrections welcome. :)

I see I've got another issue - may people have their parents listed twice - I'll have to figure out what's causing that.

Terry

June Pelo
28-12-05, 19:24
I'd say more than three fourths of the names in my database are farm names. And most of the data I receive from genealogists in Finland use the farm names - that's why I set up my database that way. All four of my grandparents emigrated, using their farm names which became surnames in this country.

June

Jaska Sarell
28-12-05, 19:49
I attach a scanning from Pedersöre storsockens historia, del I (by K.V. Åkerblom, Jakobstad 1950)showing the jury members from Ytteresse village. Påvals is well presented :cool:
The author has added farm names in parenthesis when it was not mentioned in court reports. From late 1600's farm name was part of identification.
Not so many people ever needed to state their names in official situations. But at least those few who needed to be recognized in official documents were recorded that way.

BTW. Henrik Andersson Påvals is a mistake, that should be Henrik Kristersson, i.e. the same as later.

:) Jaska

Terry Reigel
28-12-05, 20:12
I understand that many (most?) genealogists doing Scandinavian research use farm names, because of the considerable advantage it offers in finding people. And I understand that some families later took farm names as surnames.

But the question I've sought a response to, with little success until now, is whether farm names were actually used by the people in earlier times as part of their names.

The record Jaska provided seems to show that this court, at least, seemed to do so starting about 1700. That's exactly the sort of information I've been seeking.
:) Thanks Jaska.

I've made it a practice to try and record both place names and people's names with as much historical accuracy as I can achieve - not that I've been all that successful. :(

So that's what I'm trying to do here - record information both historically correct, and also in a useful form. Of course, Jaska's example suggests that it could be quite a challenge finding when the practices changed locally.

Terry

granskare
04-01-06, 00:40
at Swenson in Rock Island.

I did not find Anna Helena Henriksdotter,. born 18 Jul 1851, who was married to John Jakobsson Englund. Marriage date and place unknown to me nor birthdate of Englund.

I checked PNW 36-2, Augustana Lutheran
not found as members, baptismals searched from 1906 thru 1913 with nothing found, funerals from 1906 thru 12-1919 with nothing found.
Then I checked PNW 37, First Immanuel Lutheran. I found nothing in members lists, baptisms (1883 thru 1893).

Two churches remain, a covenant and a baptist.

Chuck

Terry Reigel
04-01-06, 01:55
Originally posted by granskare
I did not find Anna Helena Henriksdotter,. born 18 Jul 1851, who was married to John Jakobsson Englund. Marriage date and place unknown to me nor birthdate of Englund.

Thanks, Chuck.

I have no evidence that she ever left Finland. One of her sons, Alexander Englund, immigrated 1902, married c. 1909 Hannah M. ---?---, a Finlander born c. 1888. They appear in the 1910 and 1920 census in Portland, and had three children:

Roy A. - born 16 May 1910
George C. - born c. 1913
Robert Darwin - born 3 Mar 1920

Hannah died 6 Dec 1926 in Portland.

Alexander married second his cousin, Ruth Esther Forsman, after 1930.

The other member of the family I know to have been in Portland was my great-grandmother, Matilda Henriksdotter, who apparently used the surname Hendrickson there.

She immigrated about 1888, and married 4 Jun 1890, probably in Portland, Robert Edward Gapsch, a German. They both appear in the 1891 Portland city directory, which was apparently compiled before their marriage, living in the Columbia Hotel.

They had three children in Portland, the first being my grandmother:

Emma Sophia - born 24 Apr 1891
Robert Henry - born 30 Oct 1892 died 23 Jul 1893
Edward Henry - born 30 Oct 1893

They then moved some 13 miles west of Portland, to Reedville, Washington Co., where they had 4 more children, before moving across the Columbia to LaCenter Washington, in 1900.

It would be great if church records of any of these events can be found - I have little documentation of most of them.

Terry Reigel

Jaska Sarell
04-01-06, 21:36
Johan Jakobsson Englund was born on 30 May 1850 at Bjon farm of Norrby village, which then belonged to Pedersöre (later to Kronoby). His father was Jakob Jonasson (Tast- Bjon-) Englund, b. 10 May 1829 in Kaustinen. Mother was Caisa Greta Johansdotter Lillsunde, b. 16 Aug 1826 in Kronoby. They had a croft at Bjon farm, where grandfather had moved to farm from Tast in Kaustinen (Sw. Kaustby).
Johan Jakobsson first married Maria Andersdotter Björn, b. 21 Nov 1848 in Larsmo (according to communion book, not verified), d. 19 Jul 1875 in Kronoby.
Second marriage on 18 Dec 1879 in Esse with Anna Helena Henriksdotter Påvals, b. 18 Jul 1850. Children:
Alexandra 8 Jul 1881, christened in Janakkala
Alexander 29 Dec 1885, christened in Esse
Eva Maria 17 Jul 1887
Selma 5 Dec 1889

The available communion books from Kronoby at the National Archives ended 1894.
If someone in Kronoby could look further, they should appear at page 218 in the next volume. :cool:

BTW. Someone may wonder about Janakkala - that's where Anna Helena's uncle Matts Jakobsson (Påvals-) Forsman moved in 1865 to work for Tervakoski papermill.

:) Jaska

Hasse
05-01-06, 10:19
Originally posted by Jim Bailey
...Obviously, the "star" which keeps appearing in my e-mail address should be an "at" symbol...

Just to clarify...

I'm responsible for the automatic replacement of the commercial at -symbol with the star. This to try to make it a little more difficult for the email harvesters that try to collect email addresses from our pages. /Hasse

granskare
06-01-06, 00:06
I had found a lot of stuff at a former Swede- Finn Lutheran church in Rochester, WA but because I've sent it on to Terry, I will leave it to him to post here.

Today I checked a big list at Portland, OR but nobody showed up for the party:(
I checked Aug. Luth., 1st Imm. Luth, Tabor church, and 1st Cov with nothing to show for it.
I have a list of Johnsons to try tomorrow in OR.

btw, this is the Swenson list of churches:
http://www.augustana.edu/swenson/SwedishAmericanChurchIndex/FirstPageChurch.htm

Chuck

:)

Elodie Englund
03-03-11, 21:28
Thanks, Chuck.

I have no evidence that she ever left Finland. One of her sons, Alexander Englund, immigrated 1902, married c. 1909 Hannah M. ---?---, a Finlander born c. 1888. They appear in the 1910 and 1920 census in Portland, and had three children:

Roy A. - born 16 May 1910
George C. - born c. 1913
Robert Darwin - born 3 Mar 1920

Hannah died 6 Dec 1926 in Portland.

Alexander married second his cousin, Ruth Esther Forsman, after 1930.

The other member of the family I know to have been in Portland was my great-grandmother, Matilda Henriksdotter, who apparently used the surname Hendrickson there.

She immigrated about 1888, and married 4 Jun 1890, probably in Portland, Robert Edward Gapsch, a German. They both appear in the 1891 Portland city directory, which was apparently compiled before their marriage, living in the Columbia Hotel.

They had three children in Portland, the first being my grandmother:

Emma Sophia - born 24 Apr 1891
Robert Henry - born 30 Oct 1892 died 23 Jul 1893
Edward Henry - born 30 Oct 1893

They then moved some 13 miles west of Portland, to Reedville, Washington Co., where they had 4 more children, before moving across the Columbia to LaCenter Washington, in 1900.

It would be great if church records of any of these events can be found - I have little documentation of most of them.

Terry Reigel

I don't know if this post is too old to find anyone involved but I am the daughter of Roy Alexander Englund, son of Alexander Englund. Anyone who has further infomation would be great. Thanks