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Hasse
30-04-09, 10:56
As I wrote in a different message thread earlier there seem to be a difficulty currently in getting for example Swedish and Finnish text translated into English. Translation is a time consuming job especially when the texts are old Swedish and Finnish. However this assistance is often something that our American members need the most.

The whole idea behind both Finlander and Finlander Talko is helping. Some have the ability to look up and perhaps understand HisKi and the communion books better than others. Others can translate from Swedish to English or the other way around. The same with Finnish and English. Some of the members in Finland may have access to and understanding of records and originals in Finland that are hard to get access to for people in the US.

Seen from the American horizon... Some American members there may have access to different databases and libraries and may have the possibility to lookup for the members in Finland. Some sources are "free" but others are quite expensive.

The issue that I have noticed for some time now is that less people on both sides of the Atlantic seem to want to spend time assisting the fellow Finlander member. Is this a lack of interest or what? Is there a lack of appriciation?

Could SFHS office assist here in some way? How could we activate people again? Should we find a way to financially assist those who spend hundreds of dollars on for example Ancestry just to help others...in addition to their effort?

Any thoughts? Anybody?

Karen Norwillo
30-04-09, 17:18
Hasse,
Mostly I do what I do for the love of it. I like a good challenge. I usually don't mind absorbing minimal costs, but sometimes they do get "pricey." I know it's usually easier for me to get copies of records from this end, than it is for someone in Finland to try and get them. I just purchased a new reference book from Ancestry that gives addresses, websites and contacts for all the 50 states to search for info or get copies of vital documents. If anyone has a question, feel free to ask and I will look to see if it's in there. Yes the cost of Ancestry membership is expensive, but I find it worth it. You just have to learn to be abit creative sometimes. Spellings were not a strong point years ago. I will continue to help as much as I can.
Karen

Denise
30-04-09, 18:21
Hi Hasse,
I do for the sheer joy of my passion for genealogy. I keep up my subscription to Ancestry,although I rarely use it for myself anymore because I have exhausted any information it may have on my family here in the US, and the Institute of Migration, simply for helping others find their ancestry. There is such a feeling of reward and/or satisfaction in actually finding information for another person on their family ancestry. For those that haven't ever had that feeling, I suggest you try it. :)

Best Regards,
Denise

Karen Norwillo
30-04-09, 18:35
Talking about getting creative in your searches, Family Search (LDS) has a pilot program under search. I just found another child of my paternal grandparents today. I knew my grandma had lost several children, so I went in the MI Births in the pilot and by entering just salmi, no caps, under the surname, I found a 1902 birth of a son. I'm not sure what the name is, it says Elish Albin Salmi. father Gabriel SuloSalmi, mother Anna. He must have been one of those who died. He would have been born between my first two aunts. Would the name be Elish or something else close?

Ruokoja
01-05-09, 01:44
Hi Karen,

at least "Eelis" is a Finnish male name.

kivinen1
01-05-09, 09:57
Hasse, et. al.,

I am happy to do things on this end, and have been successful on several questions from people here on Finlander as well as at Suku forum.

I have also had the benefit of people on Finlander and Suku to give me my requested information.

I usually try to "read" the Suku forums for people that are looking for information on the USA/Canada side of their own stories or searches.

MANY of the members here and at Suku have done the same for me.

Perhaps the best thing to do is to remind the members on both forums to "try" to interact with the other search forum.

I use that silly "google translation" tool, and I know that I am probably spelling words and using phrases in the WRONG way, but I still do it.

I think the best way is to address those of us "Here" and those on Suku.

By the way, I want to go on record for saying "Finlander forum and Suku forum are THE BEST options for people of our heritage.

I've never met a "bad" person on either forum, and I have had very good results with posting either here or there.

MAYBE the only suggestion would be to get stop one forum or the other, and combine them into one website, keeping SFHS, Finlander, Talko, Delphi and the Genealogical site from Finland ALL ON ONE PAGE.

So, Suku has Finnish and Swedish. Finlander has English.

Make ONE site that has Finnish, Swedish and English all in the same place.

Sure, the "menu" would be a little bit larger, but we are all going for the same information.

Thank you Hasse, for being our Administrator and looking out for us.

Terveisin [oh, we are cousins somewhere way back, aren't we?].

Hasse
01-05-09, 21:07
...
MAYBE the only suggestion would be to get stop one forum or the other, and combine them into one website, keeping SFHS, Finlander, Talko, Delphi and the Genealogical site from Finland ALL ON ONE PAGE.

So, Suku has Finnish and Swedish. Finlander has English.

Make ONE site that has Finnish, Swedish and English all in the same place.

Sure, the "menu" would be a little bit larger, but we are all going for the same information.

Thank you Hasse, for being our Administrator and looking out for us.

Terveisin [oh, we are cousins somewhere way back, aren't we?].

"All on one page" would be difficult. SFHS is one organisation, GSF is another. There is a cooperation of course.

All discussion on one forum could be problematic when people wouldn't understand half the messages. Closer cooperation yes and as you can see now on some GSF pages Finlander is getting coverage there also.

And yes - since you have roots from Nedervetil there is a 99,5 % chance/risc that we are distant cousins, but I haven't checked yet.

Hasse

June Pelo
01-05-09, 22:51
Yes, I calculated that Kivinen and Hasse are 4th cousins once removed through Matts Andersson Granlund, plus many, many more connections.

kivinen1
02-05-09, 07:45
Haha,

Thanks June!

seele01
21-06-09, 17:29
Maybe the SFHS could create a translation group, where people who know how to translate to and from old Swedish/Finnish to English (and vise versa), would post there contact information and rates for the time spent translating.

Then, when someone like me needs a 1880s Swedish-written newspaper article in that old-school gothic text translated, I could look up translators who would be willing to translate it to English for me, and the rates the wish to charge for their services.

One of the BIGGEST problems for translating genealogical documents for us Americans is that reliable translators for the Swedish and Finnish language are few and far between. Especially ones who specialize in reading and comprehending old genealogical documents that are handwritten and that use older forms of the language.

Example- Last year I commissioned a lady here in America to translate a Swedish newspaper article from the 1880s that was in Gothic script. Even though she knew modern day Swedish, she had a very difficult time translating many of the words, and she was forced to ask her aging mother for help in translation. The gothic script and the apparently older version of the language just was too much for them to handle.

That is why a genealogically based translation service would be so helpful for many of us. Its the genealogists who CAN translate the old handwritten stuff. That is why I think it would be nice if the SFHS set up a list of contacts for language / old document translation. Each listing could have qualifications and rates for service.

Anyway, im rambling on and this post is long enough. Its fathers day, so im off to buy my old man a 24 pack of beer, and wrap it up. Then give him a mothers day card 'cause they're probably all out of fathers day cards by now. Oh well, he will get a kick out of it lol.

Hasse
21-06-09, 18:44
Yes, many old texts are quite difficult to figure out - for everybody of us. One thing is the old newspapers, and the older gothic letters - another thing is old handwriting.

The old typeset texts with gothic characters is difficult but one aid to consider is looking up gothic alphabets on the net or simply finding an old gothic font and install it on your computer and take some time to figure out what the different letters looked like using gothic letters. After a while it is getting easier to transcribe the text using modern characters.

After getting the transctiption done one of course has to try to figure out the meaning of the text. Swedish, as every language, has changed over the years and it may be tricky for a "year 2000' brain" to understand a text written centuries ago. The vocabulary has changed, grammatics has changed etc.

Handwitten texts add one more level of difficulty to the interpretation. It can be quite a difficulty to figure out what a priest has written into the books, especially since on can often see shortened words. Paper was more expensive back then...

But you're right - there is a need for assistance here. How it can be arranged is a good question.

SFHS is a normal Society and I would guess a suggestion from a member would be welcome?

Hasse

Denise
21-06-09, 22:36
Hi Rob and Hasse,
I agree...and I would happily pay for translation services, as I feel so much gets lost when I try to translate what I find about my ancestors. I can usually get the basics, such as birthdates and death dates, but it sure would be nice to know what other notations that are written meant. Like notes written on the far right side of the rippikirjat. Moved to America I can usually make out, but anything else is lost to me and could have proved to be an important piece of information. Frustrating.
Rob, I have to comment on your ancestry. You are finding some very interesting, juicy gossip on your family! Everytime you post something, I have to look, as it is like a soap opera! :D Hope your father enjoys his beer and Mother's day card! What a good son you are! ;)
and Hasse, have a great Father's Day too, although I know it is celebrated in November in Finland. :)

Best Regards,
Denise

June Pelo
21-06-09, 22:48
SFHS is a small society served by volunteers, receiving some financial support from membership dues. I don't know if they have the resources to set up a translation service. There are a few volunteer translators on the staff, but as far as I know few of them have computers or access to the internet. Whether any of them would be willing to accept pay for translating is something that SFHS directors would have to decide. Syrene Forsman is probably the most skilled Swedish-language translator because I think she grew up in Finland. I don't know of any Finnish-language translators at SFHS.